Thread: RED KOMODO my thought :)

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  1. #21  
    Quote Originally Posted by rand thompson View Post
    Bjorn,


    But you used the Panavision DXL2 lut to do it. That Lut works good some of the time with the Red Cameras but I stop using it because every now and then the colors would bite you in the ass.


    BTW,

    I still see magenta in the sofa and in her dress in your example in relation to the blue in the Arri example.

    Arri Alexa Mini LF






    Red komodo



    I use the dxl2 lut alot but it does not make much different bus a slightly different starting point. Then I just balanced linear / pushed 2 point curves around if doing it more elaborate Im sure they can be match very well.
    Björn Benckert
    Creative Lead & Founder Syndicate Entertainment AB
    +46855524900 www.syndicate.se/axis
    VFX / Flame / Motion capture / Monstro
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  2. #22  
    Senior Member rand thompson's Avatar
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    Bjorn

    It's like you said, it can be resolved with maybe a combination of Primary corrections and one or more of the "Hue Vs" curves. But it just extra work that shouldn't really be neccessary.
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  3. #23  
    Senior Member Blair S. Paulsen's Avatar
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    So far it appears that the Komodo is what we hoped. RED IQ in a tiny, well priced body with global shutter. The major caveat IMO is frame rate limitations. I could see a scenario where you would own a Komodo and then just rent a Monstro when you need the VV look or extensive over cranking.

    Cheers - #19
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  4. #24  
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    Just an example of a basic single node grade applied to each -





    They could be matched better, but look alright in their own ways imo.

    Thanks Luigi.
    Last edited by Les Hillis; 08-10-2020 at 04:22 PM.
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  5. #25  
    Senior Member Andy Roberts's Avatar
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    So a $6K camera vs a $??? Alexa? and it is essentially a draw in regard to IQ. Pretty good deal.
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  6. #26  
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    Going back to the initial DR test- was it done at ISO 800 becuase DR is greatest @800 ?
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  7. #27  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Les Hillis View Post
    Just an example of a basic single node grade applied to each -





    They could be matched better, but look alright in their own ways imo.

    Thanks Luigi.
    It is so interesting to see all those different takes on the same images. Different styles and different tastes of colour work. I am impressed by the Komodo image by Luigi (and also think it looks better than the Alexa image). It simply is more towards my taste of how I would define neutral. And I don't mean this as any criticism towards anybody else. Clearly Komodo is able to produce beautiful imagery, but it will not always be to every ones taste due to that the end result will be interpreted differently in the "development" process. This "post process" will also demand skill from the users to bring the most out of the camera. With more people enabled to buy into the RED pipeline, we will unfortunately also hear more criticism of imagery due to lack of understanding that the image coming from the camera, no matter how good it is, is a starting point for the final result.
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  8. #28  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Björn Benckert View Post
    Its not really like they are miles appart. With a bit of balancing Komodo looks like Alexa or Alexa looks like Komodo. Did not apply any sharpening here, and out of the gate the Alexa looks slightly more crisp, like the Komodo has a stronger olpf.

    https://vimeo.com/446472497

    The matching could be done more accurate for sure but this was just one node added and no qualifiers after the rec709 conversion trough dxl2 + ipp2 medium soft rec 709 lut provided by red.

    I think anyone colonist should be able to get a perfect match within minutes, especially if you shoot a chart.

    Bjorn, do you have a 33x33x33 copy of that dxl2 lut you can post?
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  9. #29  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andi Loor View Post
    It is so interesting to see all those different takes on the same images. Different styles and different tastes of colour work. I am impressed by the Komodo image by Luigi (and also think it looks better than the Alexa image). It simply is more towards my taste of how I would define neutral. And I don't mean this as any criticism towards anybody else. Clearly Komodo is able to produce beautiful imagery, but it will not always be to every ones taste due to that the end result will be interpreted differently in the "development" process. This "post process" will also demand skill from the users to bring the most out of the camera. With more people enabled to buy into the RED pipeline, we will unfortunately also hear more criticism of imagery due to lack of understanding that the image coming from the camera, no matter how good it is, is a starting point for the final result.
    I think at this point the better digital image capturing systems are providing as clean a canvas to start painting on as motion and still film image mediums. What people do with those blank canvases will always be subject to fashion and taste and compromise to some extent. I like to play with the medium, but also like to let the sensor and colour science do most of the heavy lifting for the most part. What RED have achieved in that regard is pretty impressive imo.

    Having said that, they're all still providing canvases that interpret the colours of reality you send to them through your lenses. In the examples above, you can see that most clearly in the multi-coloured pillow, her clothes and skin, the backlit leafy green plant and the yellow pillow in the background.

    I don't think it's a bad thing that there are differences between the images at that level. If you had to match them for the sake of continuity, the image could go either way imo.
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  10. #30  
    Senior Member Aaron Lochert's Avatar
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    Tried a quick attempt at matching:

    Komodo:


    Alexa:


    Ran both through the same node tree, processing both as ArriWideGamutRGB/LogC and only a matrix and a slight hue/hue adjustment to match Komodo to the Alexa. This is not a grade, per se. Just an example of a same-pipeline workflow. I could spend more time on it with more shot samples, but I think this goes to show how close these two cameras can look, very quickly.

    For the sake of argument, here's both ran through Arri's standard LUT, processing both in Arri's color space/gamma with that same matrix on the Komodo footage prior to the LUT.

    Komodo:


    Alexa:


    The interesting thing I noticed is that when the two are matched this way, any benefit that the Alexa might have had in highlight range is much less apparent because they roll it off into the highlights so smoothly. So if you're not trying to recover highlights much, then the Komodo can hang.
    Last edited by Aaron Lochert; 08-11-2020 at 04:25 AM.
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