Thread: What’s next from RED now that Komodo is out?

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  1. #11  
    Senior Member Bérenger Brillante's Avatar
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    Global Shutter, frame rates, dual Iso, Full frame, are all sensor-based features, so I guess it won't be upgraded anytime soon.
    Red has already 4 sensors techs in use. Let them die before releasing new ones.

    The DSMC3 brain should bring :

    Instant boot up, let's say up to 10 seconds.
    Instant rec/playback switch.
    Instant magnify

    5-axis sensor stabilisation
    In-body ND (and eliminate every other mount than PL & EF)
    DSLR quality Autofocus

    Integrated wireless video for smart devices.
    Ultra bright 4.7" Red LCD.
    Separated EVF-LCD-SDI1-SDI2 channels. No HDMI, no shared output.
    At least one 4k output.

    More pogo power for cableless accessories, and not only pogo displays but focus/iris motors controls like Latitude Sidekick.

    Red needs to work deeper with Creative Solutions : Teradek, SmallHD & RT Motion.
    We should be able to have lens motor control only by plugging a cable.
    We should be able to have lens informations display on the camera body, and then sent through the monitors overlays.

    The Rangers should have had a RTmotion Latitude Sidekick built-in since the beginning.

    What's missing in Red Ecosystem is something as good as the WCU-4.
    As they don't produce FIZ controllers anymore, they should let other brands in the loop and who's better than Creative Solutions Teradek RT(motion) ?

    I mean, it should be :
    You work with an Arri, you have a WCU-4 and Cmotion motors.
    You work with a Red, you have a CTRL.x and RTmotion motors.
    I want to be able to control the whole camera with the FIZ controller.

    Also, Red need something similar to the Arri OCU, much like RTmotion Smartknob, but smaller and pluggable to their motors directly.

    So Red, please, work with Creative Solutions. Take cableless to the next level !
    Bérenger B. Brillante
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  2. #12  
    Member Steve Wall's Avatar
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    The things which have kept DSMC2 + RED at the top of the game are being slowly matched by every competitor, at varying price points. I think once upon the time there was nothing that really came close, whereas now a lot of jobs are better suited to a Pocket / C500 / FX6. Looking at it objectively, the other cameras have gotten good enough now that RED needs to really turn up the heat to justify a 30-50K system price.

    I think the most crucial updates are

    - Chasing the next level of image quality, particularly colour.
    - < 5 second boot up time. Run and gun work would suddenly become viable
    - Upping the FPS v resolution equation, I think 6-8K @ 120fps is where it has to go to improve our 4K outputs.
    - Global shutter option - nice, but not if it is at odds with the advance of resolution / frame rate.
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  3. #13  
    Senior Member Jeffrey Loewe's Avatar
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    I'm not sure DSMC 3 is for me after using the Komodo.

    Personally I'd love for RED to go to Rangers and Komodo (sized bodies) with a variation of sensors and features. Selfishly I'm more interested in the Komodo as a camera, but wish it offered more in the way of Frame Rates. If they could find a way to get the Dragon X or the Gemini into a Komodo that'd be game over.

    Use the new tech and progression to push DSMC 3 or Ranger forward to catch up and pass BMD with their 12K camera. Not necessarily in terms of resolution but in terms of IQ and Frame Rates. Red is in a strange spot where they can really see the competition finally catching up and in some cases passing them. I think they are in a unique place to have some fun with it and also push the boundaries without necessarily stressing the highest resolution anymore. Whatever they do they really should keep at it with the openess and functionality they have with 3rd party accessories like on Komodo.
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  4. #14  
    Senior Member Aaron Green's Avatar
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    Full frame CMOS Komodo with dual native ISO.
    Aaron Green - Chicago, IL
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  5. #15  
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    Quote Originally Posted by MorganMaassen View Post
    I would like to see 8k/100fps, 6k/200fps, 4K/400fps and 2k/800fps so RED could start being used instead of FreeFly Wave or lower end Phantoms [/INDENT]
    This would be so amazing! Who knows maybe next year. I think it's just about time for this upgrade.
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  6. #16  
    Full frame CMOS Komodo with dual native ISO.[/QUOTE]


    Full frame CMOS Komodo Ranger with duel native ISO
    Last edited by Brett Reynolds; 12-21-2020 at 10:02 AM.
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  7. #17  
    Senior Member Zack Birlew's Avatar
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    Had a thought about a side project for RED. Since we know that the original roadmap had everything from S16 to Large Format panoramic sensors, how about RED dip their toes into Medium Format by making their own digital cinema focused Medium Format back for several MF camera brands? They can make their own MF cinema body too but having backs as a step-up or starting project could be a nice “two birds with one stone” approach to the concept. Needless to say, some bodies and viewfinder combinations would be incompatible but as with all digital backs, most of the camera is already built and ready to go!
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  8. #18  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Wall View Post
    The things which have kept DSMC2 + RED at the top of the game are being slowly matched by every competitor, at varying price points. I think once upon the time there was nothing that really came close, whereas now a lot of jobs are better suited to a Pocket / C500 / FX6. Looking at it objectively, the other cameras have gotten good enough now that RED needs to really turn up the heat to justify a 30-50K system price.
    RED is stuck between a rock and a hard place.

    At the high end they're fighting against the premium #1 option of ARRI, and RED can no longer automatically get an edge in for gimbal/drone/crash/car rig cam usage on the high end because the ARRI Mini is available. (and truly compact small cameras such as P4K/GH5S/S1H/X5R/etc are now "good enough" too for many purposes)

    Then at the low end the likes of a Sony FS7 / FX6 / FX9 / Canon C300mk3 / C70 / C200 / Panasonic Varicam LT / EVA1 / Blackmagic URSA Mini / etc are all waaaaaaaaaay cheaper and extremely capable. (plus of course those dirt cheap and compact cameras I mentioned before such as P4K/GH5S/S1H/S5/a7Smk3/etc are all really good too now) That's rough competition which RED is facing up against!

    We're no longer living in 2010! Or even 2015, the world has drastically changed since then. RED is no longer the only big player in their niche.

    Komodo & Raven is RED acknowledging they need to drop their prices if they wish to survive and stay competitive. (I think they need to go even cheaper)
    Likewise their partnership with Panavision and the RED Ranger is acknowledging that RED has to seriously up their game if they want to stay viable at the very high end too (simply chasing "more K" is sufficient).
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  9. #19  
    Senior Member Nick Morrison's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by David Peterson View Post
    RED is stuck between a rock and a hard place.
    Not sure if I agree with you. The Komodo has been *very successful* so far. It's impressing a lot of people, particularly higher-end cinematographers who tend to gravitate to Alexa Mini, LF, etc.

    Komodo has, in effect, done a bit of rebrand for RED - those folks were put off by RED's more macho image, or their proprietary media, or their high Ks (ie a lot of the Arri crowd), seem pretty smitten with Komodo.

    Komodo has opened up RED to at least two new markets - serious DPs at the top, and even more of the ambitious DPS at the bottom, just starting out.

    My gut tells me RED is going to keep selling LOADS of Komodos, and make $$$.

    And then my second guess is when RED decides to run with the Komodo brand and make a big brother version (either a larger Monstro sized sensor, and/or one with higher frame rates of 120fps+)...then that too has a chance to really shake the market, and sell like hot cakes.

    Remember, Komodo has a global shutter. That's kind of a big deal that we sort of forget about. On big productions with lots of green screen (and action scenes), this becomes a *really big deal*. I can see a Komodo Big Brother camera actually being quite an important development.

    In short, don't underestimate RED. They seem to know what they are doing. And most importantly, they seem to be learning, and appealing to larger demos.

    My next goal for RED is to do drop the macho image/branding ("bomb squad", etc) so they can appeal to more women. As our sets and industry gets more democratized, this going to be an important step for RED. The larger the appeal, the larger the market.

    Look I've had issues with RED. I've been burned by Jarred on these very boards (which I didn't love, and still irks me to this day). But I admire them for standing alone in the cinema world, and doing their own thing. They are not a multinational globally traded company. We tend to forget that. So I always root for them, warts and all. Cuz they always just seem to get better and learn, which I really admire. That's not easy to do, especially on a corporate level.

    So onwards and upwards, and Happy Holidays to all.
    Nick Morrison
    Founder, Director & Lead Creative
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    smallgiant.tv
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  10. #20  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nick Morrison View Post
    Not sure if I agree with you. The Komodo has been *very successful* so far.
    If you go back and read my post again:
    Quote Originally Posted by David Peterson View Post
    Komodo & Raven is RED acknowledging they need to drop their prices if they wish to survive and stay competitive. (I think they need to go even cheaper)
    Likewise their partnership with Panavision and the RED Ranger is acknowledging that RED has to seriously up their game if they want to stay viable at the very high end too (simply chasing "more K" is sufficient).
    Komodo is massively successful exactly because RED went for a price that was easily sub $10K
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