DaVinci for Mac, game changer or game over?

[Arttie Puig]

So I guess the question now is, can Assimilate keep charging what they charge for their software license? Right now Scratch just runs in one computer with Windows, no Linux, no Infiniband on Linux, just like a DaVinci for Mac at $999.
I mean, I love Scratch, but I'm never going to pay what they ask for it when I can do DaVinci now, specially since it can do RED.
Now, Scratch for $999, that'd be a great contender!
Is it game over for many now, or will they be able to adapt and survive?

[michael zaletel]

I remember this happening with image editing back in the early 90's. Quantel Paintbox, Scitex, Barco, Alias Eclipse all holding on to their high-price points until Photoshop matured at which point image editing software would never again be more than $1,000. DaVinci just decided they'd rather be Photoshop than one of those high-end image editors that held on to their premium price a couple years too long.

-michael zaletel

[Sid Idris]

I tend to agree even if Scratch is rocket ready. Does anyone know if Scratch is still file based? Or have they migrated to a relational database yet? I saw a demo once that was entirely xml based.

[David Battistella]

It seems to me that whenever there is a new development in RED post, Assimilate SCRATCH is the software that leads. They are often first because of their close relationship with RED.

First wtih r3d stereo. First with REDROCKET support, etc.

I think that the term "gamechanger" needs to go away for a while.

A better comparrison might be 50K for the LINUX license for Davinci on a LINUX box. This would give you the ability to cluster machines and add GPU power.

Has anyone seen Davinci on the Mac? Is the performamce Realtime like SCRATCH or more the way APPLE Color operates with GPU power?

What are you basing your theory on?

I'm pretty sure Lucas from Assimilate might jump into this thread at some point.

David

[Arttie Puig]

Well of course there will be thousands or arguments about how it's worth what's worth, but in my opinion, the cards are laid on the table and it seems pretty tough to top it, even to stay in the game.
I'm a Scratch user, and I never got to see it realtime at 4K without a RED rocket.
But really, playing the RED rocket card will give you air to breathe for a little while only.

[John Tissavary]

I agree that the game is changing. I also think Resolve at $995 (or $50k for a really professional basis) is a truly phenomenal deal, and not only will it change the game, but it'll change the players, too.

I'm a daily Scratch user, and the day I heard the DaVinci announcement (night before they announced it at NAB) I had the urge to panic and run out and buy Resolve (forget that it's not available at that price, yet...). But after a little thought of what that would do, in reality, to my pipeline and overall workflow and I realized things are not as cut and dry as they may seem.

Scratch is a complete finishing tool - it's about more than just color correction, Resolve is not. A large percentage of Assimilate's userbase doesn't use Scratch for color at all, rather for data conform. Not as sexy, but crucial. I need top level conform tools, it's not possible for me to service the kind of work that I do (r3d, film scans, etc...) without a fast, reliable, and flexible conform tool, even though 80% of what I do is color grading.

Also, since r3d is a large percentage of my work, I need something that works fast, stable, and squeezes every last bit of goodness out of the raw footage. Scratch does that. I've tried doing r3d work in a Resolve pipeline, and frankly I'd rather use Scratch (but that's me). When DaVinci gets mature handling of r3d and arri raw in Resolve then I'll be able to consider it as a grading tool for my work, but I prefer to work from raw over transcoded log dpx whenever possible, so for now it's not quite fitting my needs. Also, there's no telling if and when Redrocket support will exist for Resolve, and anyone that's used a Redrocket knows there's no going back from that!

I do believe everyone, including Assimilate, will have to make changes to their pricing structure - I think that's a good thing for the industry at large.

[lionel2p]

I had a Scratch for 1 month in order to test it as a new station. I was looking for buying one in march. The Davinci announce killed this decision in one second, I think it's easy to understand. I'm not R3D only, so Scratch was more a "second" choice because I couldn't buy a 150K system. It's a wonderfull machine, but I'm conforming dozen of formats Scratch can't read natively. My idea was to use it as a color grading station for R3D native and DPX previously conformed on my Smoke Advanced for other formats.

Before making plans, I will test this new Resolve solution to see what I can do with it. It doesn't mean I will not buy another solution, but I really can't buy a 50K$ Scratch now with this 995$ Davinci.

This announce is going to stop lot of decisions from guys like me. For free-lance colorists, it could be a way for new opportunities. So yes, it's a game changer just now, in our mind, but let's see on real life in a near future.

Anyway, and lot of posts are going this way in other threads, grading is a small part of the work you have to do on a film. A 2 hours feature represents a huge amount of data and it's not so easy to move it from one place to another. Resolve couldn't be a solution for everything.

BM is doing his business, but I really had a feeling of "extreme violence" with this annoucement, especially for post-facilities. Things are changing, sure, but too fast !

[David Battistella]

Looking at this thread again, it is hard to imagine people shelling out for Baselight (unless they change their pricing model) when there are very capable tools available.

even at 995 if I get 80% of the performance with a tangent wave panel then I would be pleased with that over spending an extra 28K for 20% more functionality.

995 also puts Davinci into the hands of everybody to help make it a preffered tool.

This will change things.

David

[Laco Zamba]

Sooooo, where I can find some demo, tutorial or comparison review?
I want to learn more about it.

[M Most]

Looking at this thread again, it is hard to imagine people shelling out for Baselight (unless they change their pricing model) when there are very capable tools available.

Just as not everyone shoots with Red even though it's very full featured, higher resolution, and much cheaper than almost anything else, not everyone will go to Resolve. Everyone has reasons why they prefer the tools they prefer. Sometimes it's price, but in real post facilities that do higher end work, it's usually more about user preferences, the tool's ability to handle the file formats that are common to that facility (and, BTW, Baselight probably handles more formats natively than just about anything available, including Red, Arri Raw, Phantom, and a number of others), the ability of the tool to fit into specific workflows (Baselight has a published API that lets those who can script everything from individual strips to entire projects without ever opening Baselight), the tool's specific toolsets for specific types of work (Baselight has Truelight, arguably the most accurate color management on the market as part of its native toolset), and perhaps as important as anything, the level of support supplied by the manufacturer (Filmlight's support is second to none, and they're usually first on the market among high end systems with support for new formats - Mysterium X, for instance..). If you ask most professional colorists who have run multiple systems which they feel gives them the best color correction toolset and the most control, I would say a fairly large percentage would probably name Baselight as their first choice. Others would probably pick Resolve or Lustre. But all of these products have their strengths and weaknesses, just as cameras do. No one company is going to "own" the color grading business, just as no one company "owns" the camera business, the recording business, or the post business, no matter how much they're willing to give away.