RED narrative production issues- R&D priorities!

[sander kamp]

Of course I don't know but it seems unlikely to me that RED is developing their own lenses in house. The last thing I heard they are a small team of 25-ish people and hard at work making a camera. They probably outsourced the lenses or they buy them from someone else and with the potential of selling thousands of them they get a nice discount. Some have even suggested they come from Cooke since they have the same interface to connect to the camera.

But why the bold words and calling the zoom lens 'a travesty'? Are you really suggesting nobody should buy these lenses?

[Álex Montoya]

Someone stated he was sure that RED lenses were re-housed Sigmas. Only sure thing is that they don't do them in-house. It has been stated several times.

And I find funny that he states that there's "no way to skew" exposure to take full adventadge (sp?) of RED's dynamic range and afterwards he explains that it can, in fact, be done: what he meant is that producers can get nervous looking at the monitor. LOL.

[I Bloom]

This thread doesn't belong in General Cinematography. IMHO

[Graeme Nattress]

I understand exactly that the sensor is linear and in fact does not have the gamma curve configuration of the f900 or varicam. What I'm suggesting is that this is perhaps a flaw since the camera is definitely showing it's midpoint to be closer to the highlight end of the scale.

You see, that's exactly what I mean! There's a vast difference between a camcorder recording a processed YCbCr or RGB image in 8 (or 10) bit range, and a camera that's recording raw 12bit sensor data. You can't use knowledge from the former on the latter as how they work is fundamentally different.

The sensor in the F900 and Varicam will be linear too. That data then gets processed and curves put on it to get into a form recordable by video technology. That's why altering said curves can get you more or less DR on tape.

We don't do that because we don't need to make you make any decisions like that while recording that could come to bite you back later on. RAW is RAW is RAW. Yes, it's "compressed", but it's still RAW and still (always) carries the full DR that the sensor can produce (no matter what you tweak on the visual look).

As for the visual look through the LCD or EVF while shooting, there are numerous on-board controls that allow you to alter the "developing" curve (the curve that develops the raw linear image to a viewable image) in such a way as to render it "pretty" for the crew to watch.

So yes, as much as we need good feedback from users, we need that feedback to a) make sense, b) be educated by an understanding of what we're doing and c) not be written in the format that makes us think someone is trolling. We're all very approachable people here, and I've had numerous tech discussions with all kinds of people wanting to learn how the image processing flow works, and how they can get the best out of it. If you want to join in that discussion, talk about the subject, pass on information and generally join in the general education of all that goes on here, then we're all happy to talk.

Graeme

[Adrian T.]

Put your ear to the left bottom rear of the camera next to the square cowling that encases the card slot. It is really loud especially in "Normal" mode. And unfortunately, if you plan to shoot in LA in the summer, Normal mode is the only mode to shoot in to insure that the camera doesn't shut itself off. We are in winter time now, but summer is coming and a camera that can't be silent in 90 degree heat is not going to cut the mustard. Period.

Can't you see that nobody else is complaining about this? That can only mean that there was something wrong with your particular camera. Get it serviced!

And please press your enter key once in a while. Your posts are hard to read - not only for their content.

[Stuart English]

The drive I speak of is the RAM buffer which ramps up with the fan to ensure the information sent to the card slot is secure and regularized. Put your ear to the left bottom rear of the camera next to the square cowling that encases the card slot. It is really loud especially in "Normal" mode. And unfortunately, if you plan to shoot in LA in the summer, Normal mode is the only mode to shoot in to insure that the camera doesn't shut itself off. We are in winter time now, but summer is coming and a camera that can't be silent in 90 degree heat is not going to cut the mustard.

There isn't a RAM buffer Morpheus, if you hear anything ramping up it is the fan. What operators will probably want to be using in wintertime is the new VARIABLE fan setting that we have started to alpha test (beta test firmware will be available in a few days). That mode keeps the camera pretty much silent in both preview and record modes when the ambient temperatures is 10C/50 F or below. As for Summer in LA, the first feature film shot on RED was in Spain in an ambient of 100F+, here the dual speed concept - higher fan speed during preview, slower during record works well. You will have to be the judge though if its quiet enough on set for your specific application.

[planet e]

I won't even go into the travesty that is the zoom lense they offer. That is why I again say; FORGET DEVELOPMENT OF A PRIME LENS SET AND FOCUS THE COMPANIES RESOURCES ON MAKING THE CAMERA WORK TO FULL PROMISED CAPACITY. No DP worth his salt is going to waste his time with lenses other that the Zeiss Ultra's, Master's or the Cooke S4's.

what part of "then don't use them" don't you understand? RED never claimed to make the best cine lenses, only the best cine lenses at an affordable price point. they are bringing this technology to a broad range of users, and affordability and accessibility are core to their mission. if you can afford better lenses, then you should *use* better lenses.

glad we have that problem solved. next!

[Mark Crabtree]

As Red owners/users we are all riding together in a lifeboat. You are in the boat if you have a camera in your hands now and are able to post first hand experience, but be careful what you post! These posts will be printed and proclaimed by Red naysayers and Red enemies (Sony, Panasonic, Arri) as proof that Red is not the right choice. How many times does Jim have to say that this camera is still being developed? We have it in our hands now so we can get started with our projects and help in the developement. Most of the people using the camera right now are greatful as hell to have it and are producing exceptional work. If you want to express scathing criticisms I suggest you call Red on the phone or send them an email. Tone on this forum is important because we are working with this camera right now and do not want our clients spooked. If you want to push yourself out of the boat don't take the rest of us with you.

[Jochen Schmidt-Hambrock]

Well, as somebody who plans to shoot classical concerts, he has me worried.

Jochen

[Tonaci Tran]

There isn't a RAM buffer Morpheus, if you hear anything ramping up it is the fan. What operators will probably want to be using in wintertime is the new VARIABLE fan setting that we have started to alpha test (beta test firmware will be available in a few days). That mode keeps the camera pretty much silent in both preview and record modes when the ambient temperatures is 10C/50 F or below. As for Summer in LA, the first feature film shot on RED was in Spain in an ambient of 100F+, here the dual speed concept - higher fan speed during preview, slower during record works well. You will have to be the judge though if its quiet enough on set for your specific application.

Thanks for clearing that one up. I didn't have a RED on hand to verify his drive noise claim.