Canon Vs Scarlett and why I held off on the click to order...

[Stephen Gentle]

I'm hopeful that we may get 50fps at 3K in a firmware update - I thought they said it could do 25fps with HDRx so it may be possible to get those two extra frames per second without it.

I'm happy to shoot 25fps 4K though...

[paulherrin]

i'm pretty sure you'll be able to get 50fps at 3k, probably just an oversight. this was all thrown together at the last minute, and sad to say, we don't think a whole lot about PAL besides 24/25. but if i know red, you'll be taken care of.

as far as the windowed sensor or crop factor, it's going to be very similar to what some are used to shooting on 7d's - wouldn't worry too much about that, just be aware of the way it works and what lenses you need. maybe there's an app or something to calculate focal length adjustments based on resolution? if not, somebody do it please!

EDIT: here's the approximate calculations (somebody double check me) these crop factors are based on FF35
@ 5k - 1.2 (50mm = 60mm)
@ 4k - 1.6 (50mm = 80mm)
@ 3k - 3.5 (50mm = 175mm)

shooting at 4k is just like shooting on any APS-C sensor (i.e. 7d)

on a side note, i'd like to see them push for some 4.5k at 24/25

[Jesper Sichlau]

on a side note, i'd like to see them push for some 4.5k at 24/25

Yeah that would be great.

I can see why people would want the Canon camera. It really does make pretty pictures. But I can't believe the price of this camera. You can get a working Scarlet-X (without lenses of course - but that's just like the Canon and a lot of people already have those lenses anyway) at almost two thirds of the price.

[James Carlsen]

While not an exhaustive comparison: 1) c300 is a 4:2:2 8-bit compressed image at 50Mbps (that is megaBITS), Scarlet is Redcode RAW at 55MBps (megaBYTES = 440Mbits) = lots more information AND in RAW; 2) If you want to shoot for 1080 out, you have still way more options on the Scarlet to get there a) shoot 3k at 4:1 RAW and then crop in if you choose to, or have safe area for post stabilization for any shaky handheld without having to upres to get your 1080, OR 2k@25fps RC3:1 -- C300 @1080 up to 30fps, so in your case 25. No wiggle room without upres for crops or stabilization. Want 60fps? Scarlet can shoot it at 2k RC4:1; c300 @720.

I think a lot of people fail to understand just HOW important RAW is... For the world of me, I completely fail to understand why on earth RED is the ONLY company understanding this...

I know a LOT of professional photographers that shoot in JPEG and when I ask them why, they say - It looks just as good as RAW... I say... Yeah... But ONLY if you are planning on keeping the looks of the image exactly as it came from the camera.
Once I explain to them what RAW is and does... Then all of a sudden they all shoot in RAW and then convert to JPEG.

Whatever magic codec Canon has put in the 300 - It aint NEVER going to yield esthetics of footage shot in RAW...
Althought Mobius short looked nice.

Anyway, to me... The Scarlettx is the winner in all categories. ALL.

[Andy White]

i'm pretty sure you'll be able to get 50fps at 3k, probably just an oversight. this was all thrown together at the last minute, and sad to say, we don't think a whole lot about PAL besides 24/25. but if i know red, you'll be taken care of.

as far as the windowed sensor or crop factor, it's going to be very similar to what some are used to shooting on 7d's - wouldn't worry too much about that, just be aware of the way it works and what lenses you need. maybe there's an app or something to calculate focal length adjustments based on resolution? if not, somebody do it please!

EDIT: here's the approximate calculations (somebody double check me) these crop factors are based on FF35
@ 5k - 1.2 (50mm = 60mm)
@ 4k - 1.6 (50mm = 80mm)
@ 3k - 3.5 (50mm = 175mm)

shooting at 4k is just like shooting on any APS-C sensor (i.e. 7d)

on a side note, i'd like to see them push for some 4.5k at 24/25

http://www.abelcine.com/fov/ - this is very useful for camera/sensor & FOV comparisons...

[Mark Tierney]

I had the same issue re slowmo strobing. Short answer: yes - if you have cheap flouros we're going to get some.
I am somewhat terrified about those crop factors. At 2K that 50mm must be over 200mm! My 11mm zoom is going to get some work.....

[Arash Monjazeb]

C300 has xlr inputs if I'm not mistaken. That's a big plus for someone shooting with little or no crew.

IF I can get someone form RED to confirm this, Scarlet comes with touch screen focus and possibly auto tracking follow focus. Think of all the time and money saved having to deal with pulling focus properly. You won't need a focus puller anymore. You can perform complex shots with you as the director/camera man/focus puller.

[Adam Howden]

Hi Arash,

I think it's unlikely that any machine will ever be able to replace the skill, intuition and creative work that a focus puller can do. Not to mention the having the reflexes to react to an actors movement. I can't imediately think of any useful situations where autofocus will be particularly useful... maybe something will come to me :-)

[Doug Beatty]

How about when shooting 5K digital stills at 12fps burst at a sports event? AF is a great feature there.

Also, don't see a lot of people mentioning the fact that the C300 doesn't have AF at all.

Another in the win column there for Scarlet!

[Daniel Reed]

The Scarlett-X records 3K at up to 48 fps - Great. BUT for those of us in PAL countries we need 50 fps...

For example if you're on a production using HMIs and Fluro's and you want to go off speed then you really want to be able to go to at least 50 fps, am I right here.

Please correct me if I am wrong, but are you mixing up shutter speed w/ frame rate?... i.e if concerned about flicker due to lighting setups, you'll want multiples of a 1/50 shutter speed (1/50, 1/100, 1/200) at any frame rate in Europe, and of 1/60 multiples in the States (1/60, 1/120, 1/240)... or am I wrong here?

I'm basing the above statement on the old Europe 50Hz vs the States 60Hz AC cycle "pulse" scenario - the notion that the electrical cycle "pulse" leads to visible flicker if using fast "burn" lighting sources.

Jim/Jarred/Red Team, what are the available shutter speeds on Scarlet-X? I suspect it may be the same as on Epic...

...if the shutter options are the same, please refer to page 36 of the Epic Operation Guide manual. It shows how the the default shutter can be changed and includes 1/50 as an option. Additionally, shooting 4k @ 25fps should automatically set the shutter speed at 1/50 by default.

The Epic Manuals are also available as a zipped PDF collection here:
https://www.red.com/support/all/down...se_history/128


Thank You