Lens Upgrade (For Still Image Lenses)

[Elizabeth Lowrey]

Hi Michael,

I am interested in your adapter rings if they are still available. But first a couple of questions. From the photo, it looks like the front of the ring extends a good centimeter or so beyond the front of the lens itself. Is this correct? Have you noticed any vignetting on wide lenses (say below 24 mm fl) on Epic/Scarlet or RED One? My widest lens is a Tokina (Canon) 11-16 with 77mm front threads, though I have yet to actually use it on my brand new Epic. But I just wonder if a good bit of the zoom range would be lost with something protruding in front so close to the thread size of the lens itself.

I also have a Canon 16-35 with 82 mm front threads, and I just ordered a new 85mm adapter ring (which should arrive in a day or so) for my Petroff matte box to try to fit that lens. The problem with the 16-35 is the classic problem for still lenses generally and which your ring is meant to solve . . . i.e., the lack of consistent, flat, friendly contours on the lens housing for a matte box collar. This particular lens has a curve to the flange (viewed in profile), which looks to be especially problematic for a secure fit. So a screw in adapter ring with a nice wide, regular flange like the one you're offering seems the perfect solution. My only concern, again, is vignetting. My understanding is that 85mm is the next common step up in cine lenses, and it is the next size up from 80mm that Petroff manufactures in standard size adapter rings for its matte boxes.

What would be most attractive for me is one of your adapter rings to fit 77mm front threads but with an outer diameter of 85 instead of 80, which should be wide enough that vignetting becomes moot. Then I would also need a version stepping up from 82 to 85. Any chance you could make those (or have your supplier make them)? I have to think this would be of interest to others since I imagine all the new RED users that are employing still lenses (most of which have 77mm fronts and funky outer contours) are going to have to deal with these same issues.

[Michael Althaus]

Yes, the ring extends about 11mm beyond the front of the lens itself. I use them with a 14mm lens (52mm filter thread) on a micro 4/3 camera without any issues. So far I haven't received any complaints with vignetting issues but I can't tell for sure. I never got to try the rings with a Tokina or similar lens. However, if vignetting is an issue, you could send the rings back for a refund.

The problem with an 85mm ring is that there just isn't a market big enough for it for a couple reasons: Most still image lenses, especially the older manual ones that are used by the majority of DSLR film shooters have a 77mm thread or smaller. Furthermore, 85mm isn't "a standard" and there aren't many matte boxes with an 85mm bellow. The next common size would be 95mm or 104mm which is too large for most DSLR lenses.
I have to get a minimum of 300 rings produced in a batch to get them at a reasonable price, which makes it very difficult to produce "uncommon" sizes.

Let me know if you have any other questions… and as I said, you could just ship them back to me for a refund (as long as they are still in good condition). I would cover the return shipping...

[Elizabeth Lowrey]

Thanks for the informative reply, Michael. Let me see what shakes out when the new 85mm lens collar/matte box coupler actually arrives from Zacuto. I'll have a better idea then just how much I will need a screw-in solution, especially for the Canon 16-35. Since I can't imagine that stepping down to 77 from 82 and then back to 80 would do me any favors, I'm going to have to pursue a different solution for that lens anyway, and at that point it may make more sense to go with an 85mm all the way around.

[Elizabeth Lowrey]

ETA 5/04/12 @ 3:34 PM: Michael, please disregard everything written below. An extremely helpful person at the forum contacted me privately with an alternative solution that will work perfectly using readily available step up rings. I had no idea they were made in the sizes I needed and for this application, so I don't need you to reinvent the wheel. Thanks, though, for all your previous help.:-) (I'm leaving the post intact in case anyone else had already read it and was curious about the same issues I was. But if you prefer, I will delete it completely. Just let me know.)

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Michael, I received the 85mm collar from Zacuto and found (surprise) that it doesn't really fit any of my lenses terribly well. The surfaces on the Canon f/2.8 70-200L right around the lens front are too irregular and shallow to offer a nice fit. Things are better with the Tokina 11-16 but not ideal. And I can forget entirely about getting it to fit around the Canon 16-35, which has an 82mm front thread but is probably a mm or two too large to go inside the 85mm ring.

I bought this Petroff matte box a few years ago with an eye towards one day owning a RED, figuring to use it occasionally in the meantime with my 5D MkII. Until I received my Epic a month ago, I only owned one lens -- the Canon 24-70 -- and it spoiled me because it telescopes when zooming, a feature I mostly detest. But it also means the lens was designed with very smooth, very regular outer contours that fit perfectly inside the 80mm ring insert that came with the matte box, and you can clamp the mattebox directly to the lens with no security issues or light leaks. Little did I imagine how difficult it would be to get a good fit with other still lenses.

I would just go with a soft donut bellows since I now have rails and a bracket to interface with and support the matte box, but I was counting on being able to use the matte box to double as lens support around my larger Canon lens (the 70-200, and perhaps an even longer lens I might buy or rent in the future). The Epic Titanium mount feels rock solid, and I'm sure the lens could be used bare with no support at all. But adding the weight of even a relatively light matte box (like the Petroff) with full flags and a couple of 4x5.65 filters makes the worrier in me want to have some extra support out at the end, and I think having a rigid plastic (or aluminum) collar that fits inside the matte box and is supported by rails below is the best and most efficient solution.

Zacuto stocks both a 90mm and a 95mm insert, and either would be wide enough to accommodate any lens I'm every likely to use and would have the additional benefit of eliminating all concerns with vignetting on any lens, not matter how wide. So I would want a ring like the ones you have with a 77mm thread and an o.d. of 90 or 95mm, whichever might be cheaper to make. I would also need a version with an 82mm front thread. And if that would get prohibitively expensive, I would want just the 82mm front thread version and would use a relatively cheap, standard metal step up ring to bring the threads on the 77mm lenses up to 82.

What price range would we be talking about for this scenario if I were the only one ordering, and is it even something you would consider getting your supplier to make? I'm posting this in case any of the other Canon still users would like a similar solution. (Come on, guys, I know you're out there! There have to be scores of you using Canon still lenses with 77 and/or 82mm front threads who would also like to use a matte box to fit nicely around your lenses and not vignette on wide angles.)

[Paul Mocey Hanton]

I have these on all my Canon L's and Nikkors. Great price for a great product.

[Michael Althaus]

Thanks for the bumb :) (bump)

[Vance Colvig]

PMed you.

[Michael Althaus]

bump

[Terry VerHaar]

FWIW - I have put these on at least 8 lenses (and counting) and I am delighted with the results. I have an 80mm adaptor ring for my RED matte box and these rings mean I can fit it quickly on to any of my lenses. Love it.

And, thanks, Michael - looking forward to getting the two sets that are in transit right now! :-)

[Nick Morrison]

FWIW - I have put these on at least 8 lenses (and counting) and I am delighted with the results. I have an 80mm adaptor ring for my RED matte box and these rings mean I can fit it quickly on to any of my lenses. Love it.

And, thanks, Michael - looking forward to getting the two sets that are in transit right now! :-)

Great to hear your feedback Terry. I'll be following your lead soon, myself. Michael is VERY responsive via email, etc too. These guys look top notch.