Thoughts and feedback for these three tripod+fluid head combinations

[Yousuf Abbasi]

MILLER 1741 ARROW 55:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produc...55_Tripod.html

SACHTLER SYSTEM 20 S1 HD MCF:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produc..._20_S1_HD.html

OCONNOR 1030HDSPKG (+ MILLER ENG CARBON FIBER 2-STAGE TRIPOD):
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produc...dio_Fluid.html
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produc...r_2_Stage.html

Just want to chime in and say that I've used the Sachtlers quite a bit (owned 20SB and 18SB) and these are EXCEPTIONAL heads! Construction is high quality and movement is smooth and precise. While Miller is a great head for the money, it's literally like a difference between a Ford and BMW (let's be honest, German construction is quite superior).

BUT I am a big believer in using whatever gets the job done, and for that reason Miller 55 is also one of my favorite heads because, as Steve wisely pointed out, price-to-performance ratio is enticing. I just don't know if I would ever see a Sachtler crack in the same way as you described your Miller experience.

[Steve Gibby]

Yousuf,

Over the past 30+ years I've owned and used basically every make of high end head head and legs extensively at one time or another - Sachtler, O'Connor, Vinten, Miller, etc. Early in my career I favored Sachtler and Vinten for the mobile EFP work I was doing - and back then I would have agreed with your Ford/BMW analogy. But in my opinion over the past 10 years there's been a significant change in the dynamics and product offerings in the head/legs marketplace. Companies like Miller and to a certain extent Cartoni have caught up with the previously dominant head/legs makers, namely Sachtler and O'Connor. I speak regularly about the excellent price to performance ratio of Miller heads and legs - but on this thread and others I've also emphasized my high opinion of the design and fabrication of Miller products. Again, in my opinion the problem Rob reported with his Miller Arrow 55 head is a freak occurrence, an anomaly, and in no way is it indicative of the design and fabrication quality of Miller heads.

All current manufacturer's heads are made from nearly identical metal ingredients, so in my opinion this same crack in head by an arm attachment point could happen on any manufacturer's head given enough pressure or stress on that area. In the super-mobile work me and my crews do, my multiple Miller heads have been put through way more stress-filled conditions than Rob reported that his head failed in - and we've had zero problems or failures with the heads or legs - and neither has any of my associates who use Miller heads and legs.

In my opinion today's Miller heads are designed and fabricated on a par with the heads made by Sachtler and O'Connor - but the Miller heads have a much better price to performance ratio than either Sachtler or O'Connor. In my opinion a Ford/BMW comparison is outdated - a BMW/Lexus/Infinity analogy is much more appropriate. All those autos are well designed, well assembled, and will give you good performance and reliability - as will heads from Sachtler, O'Connor, and Miller - but in the case of heads one brand costs significantly less than the other two, and that's Miller.

I'm one of those rare industry veterans who isn't hung up on tradition or peer pressure. I use equipment that makes the most operational and fiscal sense - "a penny saved is a penny earned". BTW I've always had a high opinion of German engineering - I've owned five Sachtler heads, three different BMW cars, and three different Porsche cars. But I've also owned several different Japanese cars and trucks. In auto engineering the Japanese caught up with the Germans a few decades ago. In tripod head/leg design and fabrication some manufacturers like O'Connor caught up with Sachtler a long time ago - and in the past decade Miller caught up with both of them.

Among the top level heads and legs available at present, someone's purchase and/or usage choice is essentially based on familiarity, personal taste, favored features, peer pressure, and industry niche tradition. O'Connor has dominated the cine style marketplace - but this particular Red User forum is about EFP and ENG work with Red cameras. In EFP and ENG work Sachtler, and to a lesser extent Vinten, dominated the industry in the '80's and '90's. But since around 2000 Miller has come on really strong with a greatly improved array of head and leg offerings.

[Rob Anderson]

Agree with your assessment, Steve. Miller makes a good product and does stand by it. Glad for our purchase.

[Steve Gibby]

Thanks Rob...I hope your business does fantastic there in Las Vegas. As you know, my home studio is just over 2 hours north of Vegas in Southern Utah, so I always fly out of Vegas to various areas of the US and world for work. Sometime when I'm coming or going out of Vegas I'll give you a call and hopefully we can meet up.

[Yousuf Abbasi]

Steve- I was browsing the Miller.com website and noticed that your photo was on the cover page ! That's pretty cool.. I didn't realize you were so involved with Miller. Are you sponsored by them?

By the way, I'm pretty sure if you've taken your Miller 55 across the globe and it has held up very nicely, that is proof enough its a great head. Thanks for sharing your experience on this setup, I'm glad there are still companies making high quality products and not charging an arm and a leg for them.

[Steve Gibby]

Yousuf,

As mentioned, I've been using Miller heads and legs extensively for about 10 years now. At last year's NAB I met the Miller staff and spent some time with them - great bunch of people. In those conversations I mentioned to them how long I've been using their heads and legs, how dependable they've been for me, and the affordable prices for them. I'd previously noticed that they have a Miller Sharpshooter section on their web site where people who use their equipment could submit field production stories about using Miller equipment. I suggested that I'd be happy to write up some of my experiences for them. I did that and now there are a couple of my field experience stories on their site, including a recent production in the Austrian Alps where I used my Arrow 55/Sprinter II setup for three weeks shooting world class pro snowboarders. The photo of me you saw on the Miller cover page is from that Austria gig.

About 7 months ago Miller offered to sponsor me and I accepted. It was a good move for both me and them since I'd already been buying, using, and enjoying their equipment for a decade! I've posted here on Red User on a few other threads in the past 7 months that Miller sponsors me now. Keep in mind that my high opinions of Miller equipment have been posted here on Red User since Red User was first formed in December 2006. Before that I posted over several years on other online forums how much I liked their equipment.

Miller has a staff similar to Red - knowledgeable, personable, down to earth, and professional.

I've tortured the heck out of my Miller heads and legs over the years - and the head action is spot on, plus I've never had a problem of any kind with them. In my previous post that 58 pound Red One/Optimo 12x rig on one of my Miller 55 heads is a good example. That shot of our 41 pound Epic 3D rig on my Compass 25 head which is rated for 31 pound is another good example.

No amount of sponsorship could induce me to say complimentary things about products I don't believe in. Miller is way cool. As you said, they make high quality products and don't charge an arm and a leg for them. That's a great combo...

[Yousuf Abbasi]

Congrats, Steve! That's really cool. I know Miller doesn't choose just "anybody" to sponsor, so that says a lot. We all appreciate your contributions here.

[Steve Gibby]

Thank you for your kind words Yousuf! Many people helped me and gave me great advice throughout my career, so to me its natural to complete the circle by coming back and helping others whenever I can.

I used to moderate and contribute a lot here on Red User. But after my first Epic cameras arrived my business and family have really taken up most of my time. I've been working in various areas of the world doing some really cool productions, and launching the new 3D company (Golden Gate 3D). So I mostly just lurk here on Red User now, then post whenever I have the time. As you know, when I've been able I've always taken the time to contribute here on Red User.