REDray Player...

[Geff Oliveira]

That being said, DVDs, BRs and CDs make great gifts. Its nice to hold something in your hand sometimes, with liner notes and art.
I do appreciate the economic model though. In an ideal world, both would be possible.
It should make a great companion to my Oppo BR player.

I think we are not talking about consumer products here... The way I see I imagine 4k content from Redray for reference and review and for theatrical projection, content delivery made mostly trough web in this case, and by ssd or some sort of memory media for the reference and review stuff.

[Geff Oliveira]

There are many ways to package and distribute content, with IP delivery seemingly destined to be king. I just hope the next generation of compression technology and bandwidth apportionment practices makes image quality a higher priority than in the current environment. MPEG-2 is a decent codec but it was never designed for the level of compression commonly in use today where 1080HD signals are stuffed into 1 megabit feeds .

Whether its the new codec underpinning RedRay or something else, I see the next year or two as a critical time for rallying around a decent distribution codec for the next generation. What's the point of 4K to the home if its just going to get beat to crap by the distribution methodology?

Bandwidth is improving but for commercial success you need a codec/bit rate that is viable for the mass market in the US. Compression is a more complex calculus that faces significant pressures from powerful constituencies more focused on profit than presentation quality metrics. Bottom line - can distributors find a way to offer both choice and quality within the confines of current and near term infrastructure limitations? Do they care?

FWIW I think linear TV distribution might be more resistant to OTT competition if they hadn't tossed their quality advantage aside in pursuit of more channels. In any case, the bit starved images available via cable/DBS are so poor that I still buy physical media.

Many Blu-Ray titles use 19Mb/s> for 1080/24P presentations of well mastered content that looks substantially better than any other readily available source, most of which are provided at 4Mb/s or less. RedRay can't come soon enough...

Cheers - #19

For consumer internet delivery, as is today, h264 is the king for many factors. I've tried Google's open codec VP8, it's amazing, it holds the same quality of h264 using less data but it's compressor is not optimized to get the best of today's technology as the CUDA processors on a NVIDIA card.

For cinema... RedRay will be good having both Red codecs and DPX support.

[Maik Müller Menendez]

I think we are not talking about consumer products here... The way I see I imagine 4k content from Redray for reference and review and for theatrical projection, content delivery made mostly trough web in this case, and by ssd or some sort of memory media for the reference and review stuff.

I see potential for REDRAY being adopted by consumers. RED has already set a price-tag that isn't too high for homecinema-enthusiasts. A projector with integrated player for under 10k, lots of people have paid more for less.

If RED can offer enough content for a fair price and starts shipping before Blu-4k launches then they'll succeed. Later, when both systems are available RED could set REDRAY above Blu-4k with better quality (hey, we all know how often DVDs and Blu-Rays have been f***ed up, this doesn't stop with Blu-4k), maybe special offers, earlier releases.

Imagine a movie like "The Hobbit" being released a month earlier for REDRAY. Mastered directly from digital masters, supervised by RED-experts... In it's full glorious 48fps/3D-version, in real 4k with higher color-depth than Blu-4k. Or "Prometheus" with some additional scenes, exclusively for REDRAY. :)

How about (more expensive) cinematic releases, i mean with a proper DRM-system they could offer movie downloads the same day when it starts in cinema.

I never adopted to current download-services, because they're simply crap when you compare them to releases on disc, quality-wise and mostly price-wise too. Today. buying a Blu-Ray offers a lot more than buying a download.

RED can change that and i'll happily jump in.

[Brad Allen]

As 2K DCP servers (either as a DCI certified standalone device or just a PC with video card) are pretty inexpensive, if you use one of those as the input to your REDray projector you should be good to go for your described application.

Hi Stuart!

Been mulling over this thought for the past month or so and trying to think of a way of being able to serve a 4k DCP (either encrypted or not) to the REDray Projector. I can't seem to work out an "inexpensive" way of doing this, or perhaps our definitions of inexpensive differ! It seems to me that I would be up for about $5k for a PC solution + the software. I'm chasing a price on 4k DCP server, but am waiting to hear back on that and I don't think I should really expect it to be less than $5k?

I think there would be a real market for 4k encrypted DCP playback being built into the REDray player if it's something you guys would consider looking into? I know in my case it would make the purchase of a REDray Projector very economically justifiable. I can see the potential benefits both for indie-cinemas and many post production houses. I wouldn't even mind if there was an upgrade fee to enable it in order to cover the extra development costs.

Do you think this is something RED would consider looking into (even if it wasn't ready for launch)?

EDIT: Just heard back on the 4K server - looks like it would be about $14k here in Aus.

[Stuart English]

Hi Stuart!

Been mulling over this thought for the past month or so and trying to think of a way of being able to serve a 4k DCP (either encrypted or not) to the REDray Projector. I can't seem to work out an "inexpensive" way of doing this, or perhaps our definitions of inexpensive differ! It seems to me that I would be up for about $5k for a PC solution + the software. I'm chasing a price on 4k DCP server, but am waiting to hear back on that and I don't think I should really expect it to be less than $5k?

I think there would be a real market for 4k encrypted DCP playback being built into the REDray player if it's something you guys would consider looking into? I know in my case it would make the purchase of a REDray Projector very economically justifiable. I can see the potential benefits both for indie-cinemas and many post production houses. I wouldn't even mind if there was an upgrade fee to enable it in order to cover the extra development costs.

Do you think this is something RED would consider looking into (even if it wasn't ready for launch)?

EDIT: Just heard back on the 4K server - looks like it would be about $14k here in Aus.

Yes that sounds about right - US $12 to 15K in an Integrated Media Module form factor, which probably does not support 4K Stereo and may not support 4K 60fps, and almost certainly does not support both. So assume $25 to $30K to support stereo 4K at 60 fps playback. Which illustrates just how compelling REDray and REDray Projector are when both of those support that capability as standard at their respective price points.

[Brad Allen]

Yes that sounds about right - US $12 to 15K in an Integrated Media Module form factor, which probably does not support 4K Stereo and may not support 4K 60fps, and almost certainly does not support both. So assume $25 to $30K to support stereo 4K at 60 fps playback. Which illustrates just how compelling REDray and REDray Projector are when both of those support that capability as standard at their respective price points.

Absolutely - which goes to show just how fantastic it would be if the REDray player was able to playback DCP's in addition to the other formats it supports. It would represent exceptional value for money and would create a fantastic solution for post houses wanting a way to monitor DCP's they are sending out to cinemas - especially since the projector natively covers the full XYZ color space. I would love it if there was any chance of this happening.

[roryhinds]

Yes DCP payback would be amazing. I hope RED are listening :-)

[Tim Whitcomb]

Yes that sounds about right - US $12 to 15K in an Integrated Media Module form factor, which probably does not support 4K Stereo and may not support 4K 60fps, and almost certainly does not support both. So assume $25 to $30K to support stereo 4K at 60 fps playback. Which illustrates just how compelling REDray and REDray Projector are when both of those support that capability as standard at their respective price points.

Ive been sold since I signed up to Reduser on RedRay... so how goes production, ramp up, development... without giving away trade secrets
dates. I understand secrecy of sorts for cameras but the end game requires planning. are these breakthroughs needing months, or years more of development - how many times have you changed directions? :)

what i saw at NAB exceeded expectations and was introduced with a "we won't have the 4K unil the last day of NAB) and it still wowed.

Ive got many many thoughts on how to use this device for the new distribution of independent scripted entertainment.

thanks and congrats on how far you have come and to the path ahead. While delivering to the status quo and standards bodies
there exists additional small venue applications. Content will always be king but it sure will be nice to serve
up indies in stunning ultra high definition while eating chilean sea bass :)

cheers