Cancel that thought...

[Cüneyt Kaya]

you know that your beloved alexa look is created with a low con filter and an internal LUT? If you cant let the epic look like alexa, you dont know your tools.

I have an EPIC and Alexa and use the Alexa 99% of the time. It has nothing to do with workflow, post houses have both workflows down easily. It's simply the image. Also, my Alexa shoots 120 fps using the entire sensor which would be my pref over cropping the sensor. 300fps crops the sensor so extremely I consider it unusable. Would rather just rent a Phantom. Dragon will change this of course, but it will also still possibly be stuck with the "RED look". People like myself don't just pay 50-70% more money for an Alexa for the hell of it, there's a very good reason. Producer's reasons for asking for an Alexa is because of results. They don't care how lightweight an EPIC is, or how much you didn't have to pay for upgrades, or how good the community is, or how often Jim posts in the middle of the night. The Alexa has an amazing look and that is all they care about. I feel the same. I wish my Alexa was as lightweight and small as my EPIC, but the image easily makes up for it (and not needing to deal with fan speed management or needing a Pro I/O module helps a lot as well).

If you love your RED camera, then love on it all day and rejoice in the fantastic technology at a fairly cheap price, but I wouldn't go making assumptions on why other people choose the cams they choose. Just putting in my 2 cents as it bugs me every time I hear people give what I feel are false justifications why they think people all don't use REDs all the time. There is no "Alexa problem". RED is leading the way for getting a lot of stuff for less money (although BlackMagic just made a major dent in that ratio) and ARRI is leading the way in best image. Producers would rather the latter as they aren't camera owners. Same with colorists. They like that the image looks almost perfect straight out of the gate rather than messing with secondaries to get all the colors in order and that saves a lot of time and money. There are many, many reasons beyond things that RED owners enjoy about their cams. Many things to consider. No camera is THE answer. I wouldn't see it as a problem that you can't get everyone on the planet to use the same thing you own.

Personally I don't care if the Zacuto tests exist or not as I can do my own Red vs Alexa tests all day in my pajamas. But I certainly don't understand what all the animosity is about it.

[Rehan K]

We are going to take down our offer to do a comparison test at RSH. The grief and complication doesn't warrant the effort.

This was never a good idea anyway. No matter what the outcome, any test done by the manufactures themselves would be considered "biased"

Let the third-party do the "shootouts"

[Martin Weiss]

Please let us not turn this into a X vs. Y fight.

And do not get personal.

[Gunleik Groven]

Please let us not turn this into a X vs. Y fight.

And do not get personal.

Yes, Martin... Let's!

Hours of silly fun up the sleaves... :)

[George Petersen]

Well, y'all are Red and them fellas is jus' plain yella!

[Jason Sinclair]

I think, just keep to the Red plan and don't worry about the competition. Already fate has been good with the 3d rigs and the major productions being shot this year. You can't try and be everything to everyone.

Red has carved a good niche. It really needs to further the personal pursuit rather than the competitive one.

For what i am interest in personally in style and needs, it has all the hallmarks, and so i am not interested in the Alexa or dslr's at all.

There's still a lot needed to be done to make the dsmc system really working and pushing its advantages. For me its a tool which needs to be open and inclusive to take advantage of its very nature.

Never before has technology and distribution seen such change as what is unfolding before our eyes in this industry. All we can do is follow our own integrity.

And that's my point. When you follow your own integrity, you don't care what the competition is doing because there is no competition. You are making choices on your own individual path. There's no race to the end... you can't take money with you after you have died. There's an integrity of individual purpose to uphold and maintain above all other. Otherwise, what is the point?

[Mark Toia]

I have an EPIC and Alexa and use the Alexa 99% of the time. It has nothing to do with workflow, post houses have both workflows down easily. It's simply the image. Also, my Alexa shoots 120 fps using the entire sensor which would be my pref over cropping the sensor. 300fps crops the sensor so extremely I consider it unusable. Would rather just rent a Phantom. Dragon will change this of course, but it will also still possibly be stuck with the "RED look". People like myself don't just pay 50-70% more money for an Alexa for the hell of it, there's a very good reason. Producer's reasons for asking for an Alexa is because of results. They don't care how lightweight an EPIC is, or how much you didn't have to pay for upgrades, or how good the community is, or how often Jim posts in the middle of the night. The Alexa has an amazing look and that is all they care about. I feel the same. I wish my Alexa was as lightweight and small as my EPIC, but the image easily makes up for it (and not needing to deal with fan speed management or needing a Pro I/O module helps a lot as well).

If you love your RED camera, then love on it all day and rejoice in the fantastic technology at a fairly cheap price, but I wouldn't go making assumptions on why other people choose the cams they choose. Just putting in my 2 cents as it bugs me every time I hear people give what I feel are false justifications why they think people all don't use REDs all the time. There is no "Alexa problem". RED is leading the way for getting a lot of stuff for less money (although BlackMagic just made a major dent in that ratio) and ARRI is leading the way in best image. Producers would rather the latter as they aren't camera owners. Same with colorists. They like that the image looks almost perfect straight out of the gate rather than messing with secondaries to get all the colors in order and that saves a lot of time and money. There are many, many reasons beyond things that RED owners enjoy about their cams. Many things to consider. No camera is THE answer. I wouldn't see it as a problem that you can't get everyone on the planet to use the same thing you own.

Personally I don't care if the Zacuto tests exist or not as I can do my own Red vs Alexa tests all day in my pajamas. But I certainly don't understand what all the animosity is about it.

Oh my.....
Your so lucky Im not a moderator on this forum.

I've never heard so much poo in a single paragraph for a such a long time.

I shoot Alexa's and EPiC's side by side some days... and there is no way in hell some HD PRO RES Alexa image is better than a RAW 5k image from RED.
I think your knowledge in the grading suite must be quite limited to be farting out statements that.
You really need to be more educated I think about how to get the most from your cameras files.

I can make my RED files look like ARRI images so easily... I do it all the time... but there is no way you can make a ALEXA image as sharp or as clean or a big as an EPIC image... I can't get the stills from the ALEXA into print ad's billboards either... resoltuion just does not let me get any where near EPIC specs...

Chris... you need someone to show you how to use your RED properly i think. Or at least show you how to use your RED RAW files correctly.

[Evan Starkey]

Yep.... cant get clearer than that Mark......Plus the horse and you said poo.... LMFAO

[Gunleik Groven]

All Mark says is true. Allways.
Especially if you have the needs he describes :)

But of course you can filter yourself to look like an Alexa. :) Isn't that common knowledge?

[Evan Starkey]

After the last couple of days im not sure what is common knowledge any more :) ...Steve / Zacuto gave Jim the chalenge to tell the difference between the cameras ? if its true and you cant them apart what was the point of the test ? Oh well i dont know but its fun to think about this stuff :)