Red Production Pack base plate dovetail problem

[Chris B. Hill]

Hello everyone,

While I am a new to posting on RED User, I have been reading the threads here for over a year. I am the owner of Camera #270 and am just starting to put the Camera through its paces with my partner. We have been very pleased so far with most aspects of the camera and accessories, but we had a concern we wanted to discuss and get more input from the community and RED.

Being one of the owners of Hill Production Service, a 35mm motion picture camera rental house, I have more than 20 years of hands on experience working with this camera equipment (Arri, Moviecam, Mitchell, Photo Sonics, etc.) From what I have observed from the various posts and from my own hands on use of the Red Base Production Pack’s base plate dovetail combination, I felt compelled to join the conversation.

The Base Production Pack is a really good deal for all that’s included in the package, however, we have found that there is considerable amount of space between the dovetail and bottom plate. This combined with the locking system (using the pin and offset holes) causes the system not to lock in securely with the brake on when attached to a tripod. When the weight of the camera is added, there is quite a bit of "slop" or wiggle room in the Base Production Pack’s base plate dovetail combination.

We contacted RED support and we eventually swapped out the parts for a set that was somewhat better, but still loose enough to be considered unacceptable by industry standards. (And we do appreciate the time spent with use by RED support).
At the time, RED just did not have any more answers than to give us a slightly better fitting part, but still with some wiggle room, with just the weight of the camera added to the setup.

I have noticed several other threads on RED User where people have complained about the quality of this one particular piece and felt it was in the best interest of every RED owner to have RED address this issue completely. We certainly do not feel comfortable sending out the Camera with the RED Base Production Pack’s bottom plate/dovetail in this condition. (We are looking into alternatives)

While there is something to be said for trying to create an inexpensive part for the entry level market, I do not believe this part is up to the standards of the rest of the other RED accessories, and would like put in a request in resolving the issues in this part.

Instead of Red re-designing the entire part again perhaps RED could modify the Base Plate & Dove Tail to make these parts more adequate. I came up with a few suggestions that might help remedy the problem and make the RED dovetail/bottom plate more workable in production use.

1. Add beefy washers on the 4 weak side holes. To prevent an accidental breakage of the side holes. Or screw the plate down from the bottom of the camera.
(See link)

http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?t=8756

2. Change the locking mechanism to a side clamping system similar to Arri’s side braking system this will allow an infinite amount of lock down positions for a more precise camera balance not just where the hole lines up which is about an inch between lockdown positions. It will also stop the looseness & wiggle room in the current base plate & dovetail gap.

3. Add a safety lock like in Arri’s base plate & dovetail so the camera can’t slide right off the back or front of the dovetail when the brake is off.


While it may have been designed with shoulder mount operation in mind, we feel it should be much more sturdy and of course, be adequately tight for tripod use.
As stated, we have seen a few other threads with other users having trouble with the bottom plate / dovetail design: (see links)

http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthr...ighlight=plate
http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?t=8756

We would like to note that this is the only part of Red’s camera accessories we currently have that we feel is not up to production standards and needs to be reworked. All the other accessories and camera have worked flawlessly & are very well designed, but we also feel this part is a priority and needs to be resolved as soon as possible to keep the Red quality standards superior as are the rest of Reds accessories and cameras.

.

Thank You, Red, For An Extraordinary & Innovative Camera System!

Chris Hill
Hill Digital

[Greg David]

That was a big first post :) Should I welcome you to Red user or have you been lurking?

[PaulClements]

I'd add that the shoulder dovetail from the base production pack I've used is slightly too large for using with the Element Technica Bridge plates, it begins to go in but becomes too tight to move further after an inch or so. Is this right? It seems like it ought to be a standard dovetail to me.

Paul

[Jon Schellenger]

I have to agree as well-

When we were shooting the launch of the Space Shuttle, Mike and I noticed that his had a huge amount of wobble as well. We were looking into how this could be fixed as well.

I love everything about the camera except for this issue. This needs to be addressed.

[Jay A. Kelley]

Agreed.

And welcome!

Jay

[Michael Hastings]

I have to agree as well-

When we were shooting the launch of the Space Shuttle, Mike and I noticed that his had a huge amount of wobble as well. We were looking into how this could be fixed as well.

I love everything about the camera except for this issue. This needs to be addressed.

ditto

[I Bloom]

I had a conversation with my rep at Red about this. Because I think if they replace this one part, the base production pack will be great. They've assured me that they know about it and they are working on a solution.

But you are right about getting the washers, you need them asap, you can potentially damage the finish on the camera without them.

I really like the design of the Red bottom plate. And I'd like to put it out there, that I would pay more money for a similar, stronger design with better materials and manufacturing.

IBloom

[R. Gonzales]

I to have experienced some of these issues mentioned by Mr. Hill, since then I have been looking at alternatives. Would someone at Red please chime in? I am expecting that I will finally be making a purchase in March and would prefer to go with an all Red system. It would be good to know if these issues are fixed in time or not so I can plan appropriately.

Method

[Mike Prevette]

The ET baseplate is the only and best professional option.

[Tony Lorentzen]

If it is true that the accessories aren't made within the correct tolerances then I think it is an embarrassment that RED can't possibly live with. They will get a bad rep in the industry and banned on sets (maybe not the camera - but the accessories for sure) if problems like this aren't fixed... I know I'll be sending back any parts that doesn't fit together properly.