RED... looks great, looks not so great. Why?

Jannard · 12-11-2009, 10:50 PM

Some of you have figured it out. Some have not. Some see RED as an ISO 160 camera, some an ISO 320 camera and some comfortable to shoot ISO 1000. Some see low dynamic range, some high. Some get noise, some do not. Why the difference?

RED needs to be rated and exposed properly. Then it needs to be sent through post properly. With many ways to do each, it can be confusing. Some have gotten it right and some have struggled.

We recognize the need to simplify the process... from exposure through post. And we are working on it. We believe that we will present a new way to look at shooting RED early next year. An exposure methodology that works and a new post workflow (color science) that makes it near impossible to screw up. Easy as 1,2,3.

These are exciting times at RED. We really appreciate our customers and those brave enough to shoot RED. We believe that everything we do (and have done) can be done better. We stay awake at nights working on new solutions to make shooting RED easier and and with better results.

Thanks for your support.

Jim

Jeff Carpenter · 12-11-2009, 10:55 PM

looking forward to it! Thanks, Jim!

BradWright · 12-11-2009, 10:57 PM

I wonder if by trying make something more idiot proof you just attract bigger idiots. This is what I'm seeing.

PatC · 12-11-2009, 11:03 PM

Exciting.

Joseph Hutson · 12-11-2009, 11:09 PM

woot woot. I said it before, and I'll say it again...

Do y'all ever cease to amaze me.

Josh Anon · 12-11-2009, 11:12 PM

For what it's worth, I saw Lovely Bones tonight, and I couldn't tell what was shot on RED and what was shot on Arri. I'd like to put a vote in for the "looks great" side of the argument :)

Sarah C. · 12-11-2009, 11:13 PM

Red One is a great camera. Likened to a F1 sports car.. unparalleled beauty and performance in the hands of a talented pro.

Kim Frank · 12-11-2009, 11:17 PM

That sounds just great.
For me the most confusing parts were:
Meters not always just showing RAW exposure no matter what view mode
False Colour not working properly in RAW mode
Calling the sensor sensitivity and ability to shift mid grey point ISO
Different space and gamma settings
Also I know some DOPs that don't understand that the sensor has a native 5000K setting. They underfeed channels and after rebalancing the white point and gaining the channels back up they wonder about noise.
I think the missing simplicity got people to handle the cam wrong (me too in the beginning) and made them talk bad about it (not me, not even in the beginning)
After hours and hours with the Red one on reduser and in post I know how to handle the camera but not everyone has the time to really get into deep. They need a quick and reliable how to and Im looking forward to your solutions!

Andrew Wilding · 12-11-2009, 11:17 PM

I think the responsibility doesn't lie with the camera manufacturer - Its been proven over and over again that the Red One is an amazing tool in the right hands. I don't imagine that a painter who has yet to master his art blames the canvas or his paints, or that a writer who has yet to blossom blames his type writer.

I hope you guys don't feel the burden to make this all COMPLETELY idiot proof. Expert tools require expertise. And I say this as someone who is definitely still learning!

Tom Lowe · 12-11-2009, 11:23 PM

Jim,

Please continue to....

1) Kick ass.

2) Take names.

Thank you.

12-11-2009, 10:50 PM	#1
Jannard Red Leader Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 5,438	RED... looks great, looks not so great. Why? Some of you have figured it out. Some have not. Some see RED as an ISO 160 camera, some an ISO 320 camera and some comfortable to shoot ISO 1000. Some see low dynamic range, some high. Some get noise, some do not. Why the difference? RED needs to be rated and exposed properly. Then it needs to be sent through post properly. With many ways to do each, it can be confusing. Some have gotten it right and some have struggled. We recognize the need to simplify the process... from exposure through post. And we are working on it. We believe that we will present a new way to look at shooting RED early next year. An exposure methodology that works and a new post workflow (color science) that makes it near impossible to screw up. Easy as 1,2,3. These are exciting times at RED. We really appreciate our customers and those brave enough to shoot RED. We believe that everything we do (and have done) can be done better. We stay awake at nights working on new solutions to make shooting RED easier and and with better results. Thanks for your support. Jim __________________ "Everything in life changes... including our camera specs and delivery dates..." We reserve the right to refuse service to anyone with a bad attitude.

12-11-2009, 11:09 PM	#5
Joseph Hutson Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 1,871	woot woot. I said it before, and I'll say it again... Do y'all ever cease to amaze me. __________________ Website \| IMDB \| GREYSCALE Movie \| Award Winning Short Film "Leave Me" Facebook

12-11-2009, 11:23 PM	#10
Tom Lowe Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: somewhere worshiping Terrence Malick Posts: 6,231	Jim, Please continue to.... 1) Kick ass. 2) Take names. Thank you. __________________ Timescapes.org/blog twitter.com/timescapes

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12-11-2009, 10:55 PM	#2
Jeff Carpenter Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 56	looking forward to it! Thanks, Jim!

12-11-2009, 10:57 PM	#3
BradWright Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 152	I wonder if by trying make something more idiot proof you just attract bigger idiots. This is what I'm seeing.

12-11-2009, 11:03 PM	#4
PatC Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: NJ Posts: 318	Exciting.

12-11-2009, 11:12 PM	#6
Josh Anon Junior Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 3	For what it's worth, I saw Lovely Bones tonight, and I couldn't tell what was shot on RED and what was shot on Arri. I'd like to put a vote in for the "looks great" side of the argument :)

12-11-2009, 11:13 PM	#7
Sarah C. Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 396	Red One is a great camera. Likened to a F1 sports car.. unparalleled beauty and performance in the hands of a talented pro.

12-11-2009, 11:17 PM	#8
Kim Frank Senior Member Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 340	That sounds just great. For me the most confusing parts were: Meters not always just showing RAW exposure no matter what view mode False Colour not working properly in RAW mode Calling the sensor sensitivity and ability to shift mid grey point ISO Different space and gamma settings Also I know some DOPs that don't understand that the sensor has a native 5000K setting. They underfeed channels and after rebalancing the white point and gaining the channels back up they wonder about noise. I think the missing simplicity got people to handle the cam wrong (me too in the beginning) and made them talk bad about it (not me, not even in the beginning) After hours and hours with the Red one on reduser and in post I know how to handle the camera but not everyone has the time to really get into deep. They need a quick and reliable how to and Im looking forward to your solutions!

12-11-2009, 11:17 PM	#9
Andrew Wilding Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 268	I think the responsibility doesn't lie with the camera manufacturer - Its been proven over and over again that the Red One is an amazing tool in the right hands. I don't imagine that a painter who has yet to master his art blames the canvas or his paints, or that a writer who has yet to blossom blames his type writer. I hope you guys don't feel the burden to make this all COMPLETELY idiot proof. Expert tools require expertise. And I say this as someone who is definitely still learning!